Fender ili Gibson

[dweezil]

Na temu: od Fendera treba imati sve ( ) a ja sam skoro na netu nasao Telemaster-a

e bash mi se dja ta gitara, i oblik i ideja daipak bude na fazon telecastera najvise. Pa slicno nesto tome rade dal Reverend ili neka firma, sad sam zaboravio, kacio sam ovde slike tih gitara. cool

[sl0e]

Ma pise da ce ih raditi Custom Shop od leta ove godine, ali mos' mislit' koliko ce to biti skupo. Daj boze da Meksikancima padne saka jedan komad, pa da naprave "narodnu" verziju. E i da, krenuce opet da prave Jagstang

[Dersu Uzala]

Imas li neki dokument koji o tome svedoci?

"Jimi Hendrix Sessions: The Complete Studio Recording Sessions, 1963-1970" je pristojan start. A kad i gde je (na turnejama & u studiju) koristio Fender, Sound City, Hiwatt, Sunn pojačala... duga priča.

Utvrditi pa tvrditi, to je dobar moto kojeg se treba pridržavati!

Upravo. Posto imas pretpostavljam to stivo, uputi me na stranicu na kojoj pise sta je od opreme koristio na svojim solistickim plocama (znaci izmedju '66 i '70) posto je pazario prvog Marshalla. Singl, album, ne pravim pitanje, ali da je njegov rad sa svojim bendom ili solisticki i da je snimljen posle oktobra '66.

Kao sto rekoh, tu i tamo je za pojedine trake koristio poneko drugo pojacalce, ali je 90% Marshall. Izmedju '66 i '70. Pre oktobra '66 ga nije ni imao tako da me ovo od '63. (ili ranije) do '66. i ne interesuje. Kao sto rekoh, pre dolaska u Englesku on je bio Jimmy i svirao je nesto peto.

[Dersu Uzala]

Ma pise da ce ih raditi Custom Shop od leta ove godine, ali mos' mislit' koliko ce to biti skupo. Daj boze da Meksikancima padne saka jedan komad, pa da naprave "narodnu" verziju. E i da, krenuce opet da prave Jagstang

Imas i jeftiniju varijantu a sjajno radi, probao sam ih.



http://www.maldenguitars.com/storeMozak3ts.htm

[Rocket Roll]

Posto imas pretpostavljam to stivo, uputi me na stranicu na kojoj pise sta je od opreme koristio na svojim solistickim plocama (znaci izmedju '66 i '70)...

Što ne bi pogledao sam? Da ja ne mogu da razlikujem zvuk faza u Maršala od zvuka faza u (recimo) Deluxe Reverba, ne bih imao tako konačne teorije po pitanju Hendriksa itd. nego bih seo, slušao i čitao

[Bluesko]

Ma da je Hendriks mogao i znao da svira te ''kiborg fore'', garant bi i to radio, pre paljenja...

Mislim, Hendras je jedan od najzasluznijih za promovisanje gitar-herojstva i instrumentalisticke onanije u roku, tako da...
Nemojmo biti nepravedni prema legitimnim naslednicima njegovog koncepta.

Tacno tako. Ono sto je najporaznije je da recimo lik poput Jan Akkermana koji je svirao pa ubijao tih istih godina kao i Dzimi nije mogao da dobije slicne akolade iz prostog razloga sto je Holandjanin koji je ziveo u Holandiji i izdavao za holandske gramofonske kuce. Tip je svetlosnim godinama bio ispred Dzimija po poimanju gitare i egzekuciji. Nikakav show, dosadan lik samo delje MUZIKU sto rece eg303. To je muzika, a ne proizvodnja feedbacka, pistanje wah-waha, divljanje po kurbli i slicne fore.


Elem, i Hendrix ce nazalost uskoro biti zaboravljen kao i mnogi pre njega u koje su se nasi oci kleli. Odrzavaju njegovu popularnost kojekakvi casopisi koji svake godine izbacuju kojekakve liste naj naj ovoga ili onoga, i gde u editorskoj sobi vladaju ipak jos likovi mog godista i stariji pa sa tom nekom nostalgijom gledaju na svoje detinjstvo a svet prolazi mimo njih. Likovi koji nisu ni culi jednog indijskog recimo djitristu, lupam. Likovi koji pricaju 'objektivno' i 'bez predrasuda' o muzici a muzicki horizonti su im siroki poput proreza za dinar na dzuboksu. Likovi koji su u mladosti pomalo svirali dok su drugi prcali, naucili par akorda iz par Dzimijevih pesama i to je to, amen. Likovi koji i dalje slusaju pretezno vinil i pustaju pretezno (90%) ziku pre 1970. Kapirate sta hocu da kazem. Oni ce uskoro u penzije doci ce neki novi klinci koji pjma nemaju ko je Hendrix (kao sto i nemaju ovde gde ja zivim a Hendrix je odatle), klinci koji blage evze nemaju ko je Paul Anka ( a kleo se svet u njega), Beach Boys, Elvis Presley. Svi su oni zaboravljeni i polako ispadaju sa svih lista. Prema tome, nista vecno ne traje ali to i nije poenta.

Uostalom, danas, kad pitaju po mnogim casopisima ove mladje generacije da izaberu najjaceg ovog ili onog, klinci kazu najjaci je Kurt Cobain, ili neki baja iz Blink 182 ili Linking Park ili Green Day. to su im najjaci likovi i Amin. Pojma oni nemaju ko je Satriani, Van Halen (ipak jos su zivi i sviraju) a kamoli Hendrix.

Jel to znaci da je Hendrix los??? Vidis,znam heeps of people koji Hendrixa gotive,a culi su i za Kobejna i za Satrijanija... A ako neko nije u mogucnosti da ga cuje,pffffffff,onda je to njegov hendikep,kao sto danas imas milion klinaca koji slusaju Studioforce ili Metallicu samo zato sto nisu culi za bolje... Ali zato postoji milion drugih klinaca koji su culi za boljeG i ucivaju u tome... Ja Hendrixa mogu da uporedim sa Mocartom.... A on je umro pre nego sto se rodio Hendrixov cukundeda... Pa je i dalje baja..... Al` ti nikako da skopcas da niko ne ovde ne kuje Hendrixa u zvezde zato sto je cuo nekog da ga hvali,vec zato sto je na tim vinilima imalo nesto vise od Marshalla... zato probaj prvo da ustanovis sta,pa tek onda gledaj spisak opreme doticnog... Hendrix je dosta mladji od Enke,Elingtona i njima slicnim,ali je i dalje rado slusan,zajedno sa gorepomenutima... I ne zato sto je imao samo dobra marketing....

[Dersu Uzala]

Posto imas pretpostavljam to stivo, uputi me na stranicu na kojoj pise sta je od opreme koristio na svojim solistickim plocama (znaci izmedju '66 i '70)...

Što ne bi pogledao sam? Da ja ne mogu da razlikujem zvuk faza u Maršala od zvuka faza u (recimo) Deluxe Reverba, ne bih imao tako konačne teorije po pitanju Hendriksa itd. nego bih seo, slušao i čitao

Pa nemam tu knjigu. Mislio sam da postavis citat ili da je nadjem online ako mogu. Citao sam doduse davno svasta na tu temu, pa je to mozda i bila jedna od knjiga koju sam procitao. Eddie Kramer jeste tupio puno u tom materijalu koji sam citao (jer je i bio producent u Electric Ladyland). Citao sam i price Roger Mayera ali sve je to bilo vrlo davno, tako da bih cenio ako imas neki konkretan artikl koji rasciscava moje sumnje.

Evo jos jedan izvor, ovde konkretno pricaju o Are You Experienced eri sto i jeste od '66. Pa onda dalje Axis, pa EL, pa BoG. Elem:


(iz Gibsonovih izvora)
http://www.gibson.com/en-us/Lifestyle/F ... areyouexp/


Get That Tone: Are You Experienced era Jimi Hendrix
Dave Hunter | 05.01.2008
Jimi Hendrix

The gear used by Jimi Hendrix, and the glorious sound he produced with it, is shrouded in more myth and mystery, and remains more evocative of tonal magic, than that of any other player in the history of the electric guitar. Hendrix proffered a Midas touch upon his instruments of choice that has reaped rewards for the manufacturers behind his equipment for more than 40 years, yet the set ups used in the earlier part of his career are really pretty straightforward, if nonetheless impenetrable for certain unquantifiable variables. Later in his career, Hendrix dabbled in different equipment, and certainly made some beautiful music on a late ’60s Gibson Flying V and an SG Custom played through a handful of American-made tube amps. But I’m talking classic early Hendrix here: Fender Stratocaster into a Marshall, with three specific pedals in between.

Said variables—and a lot of the aforementioned magic and mystery—come from three different directions: 1) Hendrix played a right-handed Fender Stratocaster upside down, but restrung it low-string-highest for standard but “mirror image” fingering (lefty Strats existed but were hard to come by, and he purportedly liked the controls at the top anyway); 2) the majority of Hendrix’s effects were heavily modified or “improved” from their factory stock condition, or were prototypes made for him by effects pioneer Roger Mayer; 3) Hendrix was an extremely agile, musical, soulful guitarist with a seemingly otherworldly control over his instrument and all of his gear. Throw all of these into the pot, stir, and simmer gently, and it’s not a stew you are easily going to replicate just by assembling the various bits of hardware and plugging them in. That said, hey, this is all great sounding gear, and if you acquire something anywhere close to it, and get your chops down, you can manage a pretty good approximation of “the tone” … and while you’re at it, maybe even work toward crafting your own soon-to-be legendary voice.

Jimi Hendrix’s guitars of choice have sparked endless debate and analysis, with pundits from one camp or the other insisting he must have liked the post-CBS Stratocasters because the increased wood at the headstock yielded great sustain; or because the slightly weaker pickups of the late ’60s, compared with those of the early ’60s and late ’50s, gave him more dynamics and let him keep the his tone clear and well defined even at deafening volumes, and yadda, yadda, yadda. He was photographed playing the occasional pre-CBS Strat with rosewood fingerboard, but certainly played a lot more large-headstock models in 1967 and ’68, an apparent preference that runs contrary to pre-CBS/post-CBS Stratocaster values on the vintage market today. Personally, I think the fact that the big headstock/big sustain theory fails to account for the fact that different cuts of maple used in guitar-neck manufacturing have very different weights and densities anyway, and therefore contribute to different tones—regardless of a couple extra square inches of wood in the headstock—makes poppycock of the notion.

For the inside scoop, though, let’s turn to a greater authority. In addition to building and/or modifying Hendrix’s effects pedals, Roger Mayer served as Jimi’s pal, confidant, and right-hand man regarding all things guitar-gear related. He did everything from attending studio sessions to tweak equipment on the fly, to procuring and setting up guitars, to helping to boost the famously shy guitarist’s confidence to help coax legendary performances from him. “So,” I asked my friend Roger down the phone, “what about this whole headstock/sustain issue?”

“No, Jimi wouldn’t have considered that,” he told me. “All the guitars that we used were bought out of necessity; there weren’t that many Stratocasters around in those days, and they were very expensive. Also, in the 1960s nobody paid much attention to whether pre-CBS Fenders were any better than CBS Fenders. They were all about the same, and often none of them were very good, to tell you the truth. I can’t see a slightly bigger headstock making any difference anyway.” Common sense prevails here, I think. Walk into a music shop in the London of 1967, on the hunt for a replacement Strat for a recording session, and the vast majority of what would be facing you—not that many to choose from at that—would be the latest imports of new models.

Some elements of Hendrix’s Strat set up that would make a little difference, of course, would be the variables thrown up by that right-hander-upside-down factor: winding the low E around the furthest tuning post from the nut and the high E around the nearest will introduce some changes in the sounds of these strings, and using a right-handed vibrato upside down alters the way this piece of hardware performs. Pundits also point the fact that the flip-flop would place the compensated pole pieces under the D and G strings (the latter originally a little higher than the former) in their reverse configuration, but that would have a minimal affect at best. And, again we have Roger Mayer to thank for the tidbit information confirming that Hendrix very consciously used a .015 gauge G string in his Fender 150 Series Rock’n’Roll Lights rather than a .017, in order to keep the G from leaping out volume-wise. But you know, Hendrix would have sounded like Hendrix if he’d played some no-name archtop with add-on pickup through a small Silvertone amp all his career… and we’d all probably be out there trying to score the exact same rig. And before you go buying that left-handed neck and vibrato bridge to add on to your right-handed Strat to “get the Hendrix sound,” consider this: Hendrix borrowed bassist Noel Redding’s Telecaster to record both “Hey Joe” and “Purple Haze”—a sobering revelation for anyone who ever quoted those tracks as classic examples of Jimi’s great Stratocaster tone.

The Hendrix amp of this era was the Marshall JMP100, the 100-watt version of the model colloquially known as the “plexi.” We examined Marshall’s JTM45 and “Bluesbreaker” combo in some detail in Get That Tone: Eric Clapton, and while the plexi models of the late 1960s used almost identical circuits, some of the components in the mix had changed. Most notably, perhaps, the amps now used British EL34 tubes instead of US 5881s or European KT66s. The EL34 has a distinctive, crunchy rock tone of its own when cranked up, with a slightly smoother, juicier overdrive than these other types; it’s also a more robust tube, and can be run at slightly higher voltages to produce a little more volume. To that end, Marshall dropped its GZ34 tube rectifier around the time of the transition to plexi specs, changing to firmer solid-state rectification.

In the form of the large 100-watters that Hendrix used, these were big, punchy sounding amps. They stayed relatively clean up to phenomenal volume levels, and once they tipped over into distortion they really wailed. Listen closely to Hendrix’s tone, however, and you realize a lot of it really is fairly clean, while very dynamic and touch sensitive. Although we think of him as an early proponent of both hard rock and psychedelic rock, and the most revered rock lead player of all time, his core tone was more that of cranked electric-blues—wherein lay his roots, of course—and many passages display the clarity and depth of a massive clean tone just verging on the edge of breakup. Early on, Hendrix would have used the Celestion G12M “greenback” speakers, in two 4x12 cabs per-head, that these amps came with as standard, but a little later he came to prefer the newer G12H-30, a “heavy magnet” Celestion variety with bolder lows and more punch overall (a speaker Marshall was initially using in its bass amps), so he was really going toward projection and clarity, rather than pure juice and grind.

But, yeah, there was juice and grind aplenty. When Hendrix wanted to push his sound over the top, he rather famously stomped on a Dallas-Arbiter Fuzz Face, an early germanium-transistor fuzz pedal known for its sweet, thick, creamy distortion tones. In fact, he often used this very dynamic-sounding pedal with his guitar volume wound down to clean up the tones while retaining some of the fuzz’s added texture. The only other two effects used regularly in the early Hendrix rig were a Vox Wah-Wah pedal, placed in front of the fuzz, and occasionally a Roger Mayer Octavia pedal, an octave-up effect of which Mayer built only half a dozen or so examples in its original form (from 1969, on a Univox Uni-Vibe became the other essential in the Hendrix effects line up). Taken as a whole, these are pretty simple ingredients compared to the complex and convoluted pedalboards and rack systems that many professional players employ today, but Hendrix sure could whip up a maelstrom of sound with them. That said, it’s important to once again acknowledge that an unparalleled touch and a rare musical vision also had a lot to do with it.

Before you spend the mortgage in an effort to acquire “the Hendrix set up,” it’s also worth considering that most of the sounds you have heard on record were produced with far more creative, spontaneous, and impenetrable signal chains than exhibited by his simple live rig. Sure, there’s some Fuzz Face and Octavia there in the legendary tones of “Purple Haze” or “Crosstown Traffic,” but through Hendrix’s recorded work there’s often a lot more going on besides. To give Roger Mayer one final say in the matter, when recording in the studio, Hendrix and his team were “only concerned with making a good sound that goes onto tape, and were going to use anything we can to get it. You’d take a few different things to the studio that you wouldn’t have on stage—different driving stages to put in front of the fuzz boxes, different equalizing stages, different voltages you’re using on the fuzz boxes. As well as the technical side, one of my jobs with Jimi was to help get that three minutes or so of magic. The whole day had to lead up to that. That’s the end, the goal.”

[Dersu Uzala]

zato probaj prvo da ustanovis sta,pa tek onda gledaj spisak opreme doticnog... Hendrix je dosta mladji od Enke,Elingtona i njima slicnim,ali je i dalje rado slusan,zajedno sa gorepomenutima... I ne zato sto je imao samo dobra marketing....

Promasio si poentu onoga sto pricam ali nisi jedini, situacija je pola pola otprilike. Slusam ja tipa od '70. Sporadicno. Tad sam ga najvise i slusao. Stavise, toliko sam ga slusao da je recimo moja najomiljenija stvar od Hendze svih vremena (u svakom pogledu) Trashman, kompozicija za koju je vrlo malo ljudi uopste culo. Posto je Youtube vrlo zajebana stvar, nes mi verovati evo nadjoh (audio) snimak i uzivam. Mislim da sam imao jos jednu verziju pesme sa neke kompilacije kod nas koja je imala nekakve narandzaste mehurice superimponovano preko senke Dzimijevog profila, ako se secam.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xG9hFJqAbIE

Medjutim, kazem, ondak je Jimmy umro a ja sam cuo 'bolje' djitriste, tojest meni impresivnije, pokojnik nije vise mogao da svira i napreduje i ode zivot dalje. Jedan od njih je recimo ranije pomenuti Andy Scott a drugi recimo ranije pomenuti Mick Box. But that's just me, ja sam otisao dalje.

Uzgred, na zalost, niti ovu dvojicu niti Hendzu slusa iko ovih dana, sem kako rekoh penzionera. Ne zna bre omladina nista oko toga. Ne pricamo ovde o par tvojih ili mojih drugara, pricamo o generacijama i generacijama klinaca. Koji blage veze nemaju sta se uopste desavalo pre 20 godina a kamoli 40.

[Kristijan]

Ha! Carski! Tema sa ovakvim naslovom ima ogroman potencijal da bude ultimativno glupa, ali je kvalitet ove teme u tome što je, "as if it had a will of it's own" prerasla svoje okvire i postala mega ultra glupa. OK, imam kokice i pivu, i sedim u prvom redu, udrite što jače, taman sam počeo da se zabavljam!

[eg303]

Mislio sam da je moj prethodni post i poslednji, ali pročitavši komentare posle njega moram još po nešto da napišem. Za početak evo isečka iz intervjua jednog od hodajućih bogova gitare, Joe-a Satriani-a, na temu Jimi Hendrix (svirao je jednom prilikom sa (tada) preživelim članovima Expirience-a):
Musician's Friend: We recently heard you got to play with Mitch Mitchell, Billy Cox, and Buddy Guy, among others, in a tribute to Hendrix in San Francisco. How did that happen and what was it like?
Joe Satriani: It was a fantastic experience for me. I'm a hard-core Hendrix fan. So to finally be able to play with Mitch Mitchell and Billy Cox was just the thrill of a lifetime for me. And then the bonus was being able to trade Blues licks with Buddy Guy. I was kind of mesmerized, star-struck a little bit because I'd spent so many years listening to these guys on record and playing along with them. They created some of the most important music stemming from the sixties and on through to this new millennium we're in.
Ostaju otvorena pitanja:
Zašto je Njegovo Veličanstvo Joe Satriani, kako on reče:“ I'm a hard-core Hendrix fan“?
Kako svirka sa dva omatorela hipika može da bude: „...just the thrill of a lifetime for me“
Da li je moguće da je ceo dope&hype ustvari muzika koju je on opisao kao:“ They created some of the most important music stemming from the sixties and on through to this new millennium we're in.“
Da li je isti ovo izjavio pod dejstvom snažnih opijata ili su mu doneli da proba novog Marshalla i neku pedalu?

Odgovore u pisanom obliku najpre proslediti onom sa kofom na glavi i najbližem daktilo-birou.

U sledećem broju ekskluzivno: Steve Vai o Jimi Hendrixu!

[sinisake]

Ha! Carski! Tema sa ovakvim naslovom ima ogroman potencijal da bude ultimativno glupa, ali je kvalitet ove teme u tome što je, "as if it had a will of it's own" prerasla svoje okvire i postala mega ultra glupa. OK, imam kokice i pivu, i sedim u prvom redu, udrite što jače, taman sam počeo da se zabavljam!

Jbt, Kristijane, cudi me da je jedna umetnicka dusa takvo zakeralo, mega sitnicar...
Stalno potenciras taj naslov teme, kao da ne znas da se zapravo (uglavnom) prica o dva ultimativna modela ove dve firme.

Ljudi, ispravite molim vas naslov teme u "Stratokaster ili Les Paul'', da Kristijana vise ne jedimo...

[jcm 800]

Posto imas pretpostavljam to stivo, uputi me na stranicu na kojoj pise sta je od opreme koristio na svojim solistickim plocama (znaci izmedju '66 i '70)...

Što ne bi pogledao sam? Da ja ne mogu da razlikujem zvuk faza u Maršala od zvuka faza u (recimo) Deluxe Reverba, ne bih imao tako konačne teorije po pitanju Hendriksa itd. nego bih seo, slušao i čitao

Jedno pitanje: bas me interesuje konkretna pjesma od J H Experiencea u periodu 67-69 kojoj cujes fuzz u Deluxe Reverba.
Hvala.

[Kristijan]

Hahahaha, Siniša, ova ti je dobra! Ko mi je kriv kad imam dugačak jezik. Zapravo sam mislio kako je sama rasprava bespredmetna, a ovo sa naslovom... pa da, kad se uzme u obzir šta sam već pisao, zvuči onako malo... Ali poenta je da je ovo jedna od onih rasprava koje nemaju ni kraj, ni zaključak. Isto tako možemo do prekosutra da se prepucavamo na temu Nokia Vs. Sony Ericsson, Mercedes Vs. BMW, Adobe Illustrator Vs. Corel Draw, AK47 Vs. M16, Voda voda Vs. Prolom voda...

I sad bez obzira koliko je od samog starta tema besmislena, na kraju je ipak postala još daleko besmislenija rascepivši se u 2 teme: Hendrix Vs. Klingon Imperial Orchestra i Marshall Vs. Rest of the phukkin' Universe.

Ja bih da se tema vrati na izvornu besmislenost, lepo se "ušančili" Gibsondžije i Fenderžije pa povremeno raspale jedni po drugima - milina jedna, reality show! Ko hoće da poredi Hendrixa i Satrianija (ili šta god drugo što se (ne)može porediti) neka otvara svoju glupu temu, ovako ne mogu da se opustim i da navijam na miru! Mislim, do sad je bila tekma, sad se polako pretvara u turnir, gubi se fokus

[eg303]

Nokia Vs. Sony Ericsson, Mercedes Vs. BMW, ..., Voda voda Vs. Prolom voda...

1. Sony Ericsson
2. BMW
3. Adobe
4. AK47
5. Prolom voda

[sinisake]

Ja bih da se tema vrati na izvornu besmislenost

E, to je vec nesto drugo...

I samo da kazem - Strat je bolja i univerzalnija gitara (jesam li ja ovo napisao?!?!?!? ), Hendriks je precenjen, Stivi Vaja da ne dirate, a ni Satrijanija, za MABA me zabole, na kraju krajeva, jebes soliranje, to samo gitaristi slusaju, ostali ljudi slusaju muziku, a toga ima vise kod Bitlisa nego kod Hendriksa, Vaja, MABA i Borislava Mitica, pa cak i Aleksandra Zivojinovica zajedno...



Dobro, ima Hendriks lepih hitova...